[PLUG-TALK] Being plonked on plug...

Russ Johnson russj at dimstar.net
Tue Nov 18 23:20:04 UTC 2003


* Jeme A Brelin <jeme at brelin.net> [2003-11-18 13:28]:
> 
> On Tue, 18 Nov 2003, Russ Johnson wrote:
> > * Jeme A Brelin <jeme at brelin.net> [2003-11-18 11:20]:
> >
> > Don't we have the right to be as irrational as we want? I mean, this is
> > plug-talk, and there's no "topic" off limits.
> 
> You DO have the right to be irrational, but if you're going to be
> irrational, don't pretend that you're arguing with any kind of logic or
> reason.

I believe I am arguing logically. So do some of my friends. They just
don't happen to be on this list. 

> > If it bothers you, ignore it.
> 
> I have, thus far.

I would say that replying to a message with a "will you shut up"
response is definately NOT ignoring it. If you were ignoring it, I
wouldn't be typing to you. 

> > What "assertion of faith" have I made? Something that is "self-evident"
> > needs no faith.
> 
> So, if Michael said the existence of God was "self-evident", you'd buy it?
> I don't think so.  You'd demand proof.

For me, yes. The inalienable rights we're speaking of are certainly
self-evident. I.e., they make sense, they are plain to see logically,
and most folks also see it that way. Even folks that don't live here can
see them, once they are pointed out.

The existence of god, on the other hand, isn't plain to see, and most of
the humans on this world don't see it, even after it's shown to them. 

I've been reading some stuff today about how the Catholic church is a
lie. How Peter didn't ever live in Rome (and how there's this big
arguement about whether he did or not). How there's no such thing as a
"pope" in the bible. Just goes to show how some people can have the wool
pulled over their eyes very easily. Now, understand, I'm not claiming
any of this is true, but there's a lot of evidence out there. 

Then there's the whole "worshiping Mary" vs. no gods before me thing.

> Faith is the only proof for things unprovable.  You insist that the
> inalienability of certain rights is "self-evident".  That is an assertion
> of truth that is unprovable without faith.

No, self-evident is not the same as faith. Although, I can see where you
might make that assumption. Faith is accepting something as fact, even with
evidence to the contrary. 

> > > They're both just things people made up to fit a situation and folks
> > > put their belief in them.
> >
> > In your opinion.
> 
> ...and the opinion of everyone who doesn't hold your faith.

It's still an opinion, and opinions vary.

-- 
Russ Johnson
Dimension 7/Stargate Online
http://www.dimstar.net

Top post? http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html

Random thought #16 (Collect all 22)
"It is often easier to fight for principles than to live up to them." - Adlai Stevenson




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