Was [PLUG-TALK] I don't like a certain change on plug...

[Darkhorse]

On Sun, 2004-11-14 at 06:34, Jeme A Brelin wrote:
> y
> On Sun, 14 Nov 2004, Russ Johnson wrote:
> > Yes, and I believe that's what needs to change. People getting welfare
> > need to understand that they will eventually not get benefits (like
> > unemployment, it eventually runs out) so they need to work towards
> > getting off the public dole.
> 
> And if they can't find some way to please a rich person and get their
> survival subsidized?  What then?  Debtors' prisons?
> 
> > Unfortunately, the "progressive" folks in office have realized that
> > keeping these people on the dole virtually guarantees that they will
> > vote (if they do) for the folks that give the handout.
> 
> That somehow manages to be both cynical and naive, Russ.  Good job.
> 
> First, I'll tell you that there are pretty much NO progressive folks in
> office.  The best you can find is "liberal" and that's like calling a
> Republican a Libertarian.
> 
> Second, your implication that progressive politics are motivated by greed
> and desire for power is nothing more than projection.  The need to
> perpetuate public assistance is in direct correlation to the economy's
> need to perpetuate un- and under-employment.
> 

Unemployment doesn't help the rich Brelin, it reduces the population
that can make a rich person even richer.  As far as this government
social programs are the cheapest and best way to go mentality that I'm
seeing, that's debatable.  As far as charity goes, we need more mother
Teresa's.  We don't have a society right now that produces religious,
instead we have one that favors having sex and getting rich over taking
a religious vow of poverty.  There was a lot of discussion on here
recently about not the beauty, but the "importance" of having sex. 
Believing that government bodies can take care of the poor ignores
what Christ said.  He said that the poor will always be with us.

I'd rather give money to a mother Teresa than a government program
or United Way.  It's bad enough you go to your doctor and have
use birth control signs strategetically placed in plain sight 
with the purpose being to get you taking in their message even 
if you don't agree with it.  Imagine now that this abuse is extended
through morally corrupt state charities.  You don't have to be paid
$130k a year to be the head of a private charity, you can work for
what mother Teresa would.  A private organization can set moral
standards that a state one may not be able to and it can reduce it's
overhead by reducing payroll, a fact that has been understated in this
discussion so far.  Those who take a vow of poverty cover their own
needs but don't do more than that.  They are highly effective
at helping the poor because they're spending is very efficient.

There are about as many religious as there were in the Catholic church
fifty years ago.  Thanks to the growth of the number of lay Catholics,
it looks like there are actually fewer.  To improve the poverty
situation you have to improve religious vocations to fill the 
increasing needs.  Improving vocations in the Catholic church isn't
the only way to address this problem, there are certainly other
religious and non religious bodies that help in the fight to 
reduce poverty.

     --  Michael Robinson