ronabop at gmail.com
Thu Jan 8 01:13:33 PST 2009
On Jan 8, 2009, at 12:12 AM, Michael Robinson wrote:
> Having a crucifix is not idol worship
Praying before a "symbol", be that symbol a golden calf, a sculpture
of a man on a cross, or a golden buddha, is praying to/before a symbol.
There are interesting theological debates to be had on this topic,
but I think the difference here is that Christians began to worship
the the thing that they were "praying in front of".
> and no the early
> Christians would not have used a crucifix as a symbol
> for obvious reasons. Frankly, if the image of Christ
> is a graven image that is pretty confusing.
(or, in internet patois, "Wat?)
Catholics often worship a man (in effigy).
Since they say that a man can be a God, they worship with the effigy.
> that logic, every human being becomes a graven image
> because man is made in the image and likeness of God.
> Please don't go there.
Well, I've already gone there, early Christians say it's heresy, and
you're not making any sense.
I suggest you study the first 300 years of Christianity.
No, really, take a few years. It helps to learn ancient greek.
> A symbol representing
> the 1 true God cannot be an idol, by definition.
Wrong, in early Judaism/christianity.
The "golden calf" represented God. It was wrong at times, right at
Quiz: Was "God's name", rather than a alternate choice, acceptable
for the YHVH/Elohim groups 200 years ago?
> don't worship a symbol, if it represents God you worship
> the God person that it represents.
I do not disagree, as most buddhists do not worship some guy who
lived a long time ago.
Many Christians, however, seem to worship some guy who lived a long
> "You see, early Christians were kind of upset about the
> idea of worshipping god in the form of a man
> (or other "earthly" things), as that was a Gentile,
> pagan, custom. It wasn't until Arius's battle with
> Alexander of Alexandria, and the resulting Nicean
> creed/heresy, that Christians decided to, well, kind
> of ignore the issue, and declare that worshipping a
> man figure, *as* a part of God, was really just
> plain "ok"."
> Hmm, sounds like you don't believe in the divinity
> of Jesus Christ. The idea that Jesus is fully God
> and fully man. Am I correct?
You didn't pick that part up about Arius, did you?
Do you have any idea about that history?
> What in the Nicean creed is there that makes you
> call it a heresy?
Worshipping a man, instead of his (Jesus as a man) worshipped god.
> You see, God impregnated Mary with the God-man Jesus
> Christ which refutes the Arian heresy which says that
> Jesus isn't God.
Even if if God "impregnated" Mary, Jesus still isn't God....., just
the product of impregnation by God.
Zeus impregnated lots of maidens, that didn't make their offspring
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