[PLUG-TALK] Porn on the Net...
Michael Robinson
plug_1 at robinson-west.com
Fri Oct 30 09:42:17 UTC 2009
On Thu, 2009-10-29 at 22:12 -0700, David Mandel wrote:
> I have read this thread and would like to add my comments.
>
> (1) The problem Michael brings up is much more general than just pornography.
> The internet is quickly becoming a necessity as governments
> and corporations
> disseminate information via the internet and require us to
> use it to interact with
> them via the internet. It is much easier to unplug the TV
> and radio than the internet.
> The internet is just too important to unplug, but it could
> become too ugly to let into
> our homes.
> Unfortunately, much of the material on the internet may not
> fit one's cultural values
> and the values you want to give to your family. And I don't
> mean just pornography.
> Some people find the internet too "American" or crude or too
> western or too whatever -
> and I see their point. I suppose, those who fear American
> cultural imperialism
> see the internet as a key weapon in "the Americanization of the World"
Finally, a rational response ;-)
> (2) The internet is international.
> Bits travel over international boundaries quickly and easily.
> The social mores of one country or culture don't mean much on
> the internet.
> You can find the complete text of the Bible on the internet
> even though the Bible
> is a banned book in a number of countries.
> You can find the swastika on the internet being used in ways the seem
> to violate the laws of several countries such as Germany.
> You can certainly find information about people that violate
> the libel laws
> in UK.
> You can find the web sites for banned political parties on the internet.
> Some of the "bad" things you can find are very good and some
> are very bad,
> and I don't know who can fairly judge the difference - and not
> being willing
> to judge the difference is itself a very AMERICAN attitude and somewhat
> unfair to the world.
Individual countries can standardize laws for what can be on the
Internet. Banning free porn world wide should be a fairly simple
matter so long as the definition of porn is acceptable to the many
cultures that define it differently. The U.N. might be an organization
that could bring the world together to define "free porn" and regulate
it.
> (3) The internet is international.
> Any one country's (or state's) laws are useless in controlling
> the content
> of the internet since the banned content will simple be hosted
> in another
> country.
China doesn't seem to think it is useless, though I think the Chinese
sensors are mostly losing at the moment. Network filtering is possible
for the Internet, it just isn't popular.
> (4) Women view pornography differently than men.
> Everyone writing on this thread are male, and this biases the
> discussion.
> Many women are very uncomfortable around pornography and sometimes
> have a more inclusive definition of pornography than your average man.
> Many women feel as if they are being harassed when pornography is
> too close and when they might accidentally run into it. It
> is really quite
> a different view than most men have.
Most porn targets men, so of course women feel threatened by it. This
is one of the reasons why porn damages so many marriages and why free
porn via the Net needs to be regulated.
> (5) Porn and prostitution can be abusive.
> I don't think prostitution or pornography are always abusive, but I think
> they can be very abusive. Although I don't have much personal experience
> with prostitution, I have seen a few very abusive situations in Asia and
> I know they happen elsewhere as well.
I disagree with you here. Someone always gets hurt. Porn is harmful
because it emasculates a man and changes the way he views women. Porn
can make a man sexually aggressive, one reason why men should break any
habit they have of looking at it. Yes porn is abusive sometimes, but
take the next step and realize that it is always abusive. Sex is
supposed to be shared privately between a married man and his wife.
Porn violates the privacy requirement because it is mass distributed.
You don't bond with a prostitute and if you do, you are likely going to
have to watch her move to the next man. This is abuse of human
sexuality every single time no matter what culture it is that you
want to talk about. What does the serial killer Ted Bundy think of
porn?
> (6) Legalize prostitution
> I think communities have the right to make their own laws
> regarding pornography
> and prostitution and a lot of other things. And I don't really
> care what other
> communities do, but in my community I recommend legalizing pornography
> and prostitution and alcohol and marijuana and a lot of other
> stuff as well;
> and I don't see any conflict between these views and my Catholic faith.
> At the same time, I think we do need to do whatever we can to stop
> abuse in pornography and prostitution and to keep it behind closed doors.
You just proved you are not Catholic. Prostitution is the selling of
sex which violates the unitive aspect of sex and the procreative aspect.
Prostitutes are typically not open to having children by their paying
clients and even when they are, it is immoral for the fathers of these
children to take no responsibility for them (the likely outcome).
Marijuana is a dangerous drug because it impairs memory and decision
making. Marijuana is treated like it's safe, but it's not. Can you
really trust a Marijuana user when they say they only use it once or
twice a month? Maybe we should legalize heroin, the most dangerous
drug kids can get their hands on these days.
Neighborhoods that have prostitution have higher crime rates, the last
thing that is needed is legalization of it. Part of being Catholic is
following the teachings of the church which you clearly do not judging
from point 6.
> (7) Islam
> There are Sunni Muslims and there are Shiite Muslims; but that doesn't
> begin to describe the complexity and variation within Islam.
> It is a little
> trying to describe Christianity by looking at "the Catholics"
> and "the Protestants"
> and nothing more.
Christian means universal. It is truly sad that there is more than one
Christian faith. Some day, that will change.
> (8) History as taught in school is full of errors.
> History is a weird field subject to lots of interpretation and
> subjective judgment.
> It is amazing how history exaggerates the goodness of it's
> heroes and the evilness
> of it's villains when the truth is probably more complex.
> Today we are taught how evil the crusades were, and indeed Europeans did
> a lot of terrible things during the crusades. However, we
> don't seem to be
> taught that Christian Europe had good reason to feel
> threatened. I'm not
> trying to justify the evils of the crusades, but I am saying
> that there is
> usually some logic and reason on both sides of most conflicts
> - even when
> the resulting war is totally immoral and implemented in the
> most unreasonable
> manner.
History is taught by the winners and there is a lot of room for bias.
Catholic history is often glossed over or ignored, especially when it's
positive. As I said before about the Crusades and I will say again, the
Pope really didn't have the power at that time. Politically, Kings were
far more powerful than the Pope. Another problem was that the
militaries of European countries at the time tended to have prisoners
in the ranks.
> (9) I was orginally addressing the problem of having an internet
> filled with so much
> truly objectional material. Although I find many things on the
> internet objectionable,
> I have absolutely no workable solution to the problem.
> Certainly, government
> regulation wouldn't help the situation. Sometimes we must
> learn to live with
> evil.
I disagree totally. There is I believe a universal definition of what
porn is and while it may not be inclusive enough for some, it would be
a place to start. Government regulation can and does work when it fits
the problem and it is enforced properly. All first world countries have
a drinking age and they enforce it. All first world countries require
that you have a license to drive a car. Exceptions in the definition
of porn for nude modeling for example would still allow for a law that
goes after free hard core material. One option in the future is for
individual countries to filter the Net through the ISPs. It is illegal
to send high grade encrypted files to a lot of countries, how is that
enforced?
I recommend that people read Tom Clancy's Net Force. I don't promote it
for some of the content and I wouldn't recommend it for children, but I
truly believe in the future that there will be Internet police.
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