[PLUG] Linus Torvalds...

[Omar Rodriguez]

Hi Michael,

Not knowing Linus personally other than chatting with him at a
conference for a few minutes earlier this year, I can't say whether
Linus as a person for his beliefs or non beliefs deserves to be
awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.  I believe Linus has done some great
technical work and I admire him for that.  I guess you can say it can
be considered "the best work for fraternity between nations".
Honestly, the fact that I can contribute to something that people all
over the world might benefit from is just amazing.

I fail to understand what beliefs have to do with anything Keith had
originally mentioned.  As far as I know Alfred Nobel wrote in his will
regarding the peace prize: "the person who shall have done the most or
the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or
reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of
peace congresses"

I respect that for you peace can only come from one source but I'm not
sure that's how the committee chooses who deserves the prize.  The
fact that some past laureates have had strong religious affiliations I
don't think makes it a requirement.


Cheers,
-Omar

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Michael Robinson
<plug_1 at robinson-west.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 2009-11-19 at 14:09 -0800, Tim wrote:
>> > You never had any respect for me or anyone else who believes
>> > in something, so what is your point?
>>
>> Believing in something != belief in an imaginary omnipotent being
>
> Only you say God is imaginary Tim, but I know better.
>
>> > Linux probably would have come into existence eventually even
>> > if Linus hadn't been involved.  GNU and Richard Stallman
>> > contributed the tools after all.  Granted, it wouldn't be
>> > called Linux in that case.
>> >
>> > What has Linux done to avert the war on terror in Iraq and
>> > Afghanistan?  What has it done to encourage atheists to be
>> > more accepting of religion?  What has it done to advance
>> > feeding the poor, clothing the naked, burying the dead,
>> > etcetera?  What has Linux done to alleviate any of the
>> > ethnic conflicts in the world today?  The answer is nothing.
>
>> > Peace comes from God, you can't refute that Tim.
>>
>> Gibberish.  Beliefs like these corrupt.  They allow others to use you
>> as a pawn.  The fact that you can't keep them to your self when they
>> are completely unfounded is wher I see you've lost sight of reason.
>> This is where all respect is lost.
>
> Who Tim?  Get a life please.  Reasonably speaking, religion usually
> promotes peace through service to your fellow man, so it is entirely
> possible that God is the source of peace where his followers are
> to serve each other out of love for Him.  Most religions attribute
> incredible dignity to Man and demand that we see God in each other.
> You don't know what you are talking about Tim.  Indeed, you probably
> believe that all beliefs are corrupt.  You offer no atheistic
> foundation for peace.  I wouldn't expect you to, there is no
> such foundation.  To the atheist, Man is just a machine made in
> nothings image with no dignity whatsoever.  For an atheist, a Man
> can do whatever he wants with his body.  He can abuse it, he can
> harvests parts off of other people's bodies, he can kill other people,
> he can do whatever he wants to do to the human body.  Because of this
> lack of respect for the human body, atheists cannot promote peace let
> alone offer a non sectarian foundation for it.
>
>> You just have to understand that there are other points of view in the
>> world and yours in God or god or other unfounded beliefs might just be
>> making the world worse.
>
> The Truth never makes things worse.  My beliefs are not unfounded, but
> you obviously can't respect people who believe something.
>
>> I know I'm not going to change mind about your beliefs, but I'm not
>> one to let the vocal few loonies decide things for the silent
>> majority.
>
> The silent majority that believes in God?
>
>> Please leave religion off the list.  I do agree that talking about the
>> peace prize on the list is off topic, but bringing gods into it is off
>> topic and inflamatory.
>>
>> tim
>
> The Nobel Peace Prize should go to someone who seeks to bring God's
> peace into the world.  I didn't bring religion onto the list, those
> who pushed to have Linus get a Nobel Peace Prize did.  If instead
> the talk was about Linus getting a prize that is not the Nobel
> Peace Prize, things would be different.  It is not fair from the
> religious person's point of view to have to endure an anti religious
> God is not the source of peace commentary and not be allowed to counter
> it.  This is one of the reasons why the Nobel Peace Prize should never
> have been discussed on the main Linux list.  That is not my fault by
> the way, it is Keith Lofstrom's fault for starting the discussion.
>
> A big hint that you are not respecting other people's points of view is
> when you call someone a lunatic for believing something.  Another big
> hint is when you talk about Truth without having any basis in reality.
> Believing in a God that calls Man to respect himself and other people
> is a belief that promotes peace.  Doing what God calls you to do NEVER
> promotes war and chaos.  Indeed, God only allows chaos when it will
> open people's eyes and promote peace in the long run.  Not allowing
> chaos means that the righteous would never be tested, not even if they
> need the test.
>
> Linus probably doesn't want the Nobel Peace Prize and he probably
> doesn't deserve it.  Noone can make the argument that Linux
> coming into existence alone has advanced the cause of peace.
> As far as bringing people together, how has Linux convinced
> atheists to respect theists?  How has it helped in arguments
> about the existence of God?  How has Linux helped Man answer the
> age old questions, "Who am I?," "Why am I here?," "Is there a God?,"
> "Who is God?," and, "What should my relationship with God be?."
> Linux hasn't been helpful with these age old questions.
>
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